With a mystifying voter support from the religiously-minded and launching a war with high flown claims about morality and invocations about the historic ‘Crusades’ (mainly failures) it seems counter-productive for Trump to fall out with the Pope and the Catholic Church.
As with so much else it makes no sense. But the Vatican are not taking it lying down. Pope Leo’s Easter message issued a sharp rebuke of war. And Archbishop Broglio of the U.S. Archdiocese for the Military Services questioned the legitimacy of America’s war in Iran, arguing that it was likely not justified under Catholic teaching on legitimate defense by military means, sometimes called just war theory.
Pope Leo, 14 September 1955, Chicago, Illinois, no birth time, is just the man to stand up to Trump since his Pluto is conjunct Trump’s Mars and Ascendant; his Mars in Virgo is square DT’s Uranus; his Virgo Sun Venus are square DT’s Gemini Sun opposition Sagittarius Moon. His determined Saturn in Scorpio is square DT’s Mars/Pluto midpoint. And the Pope’s North Node opposes DT’s North Node = trains heading in opposite directions.
Their relationship chart has been under considerable strain since last month with tr Uranus square the composite Mercury and moving (across the midpoints) to square the composite Mars in July and again at the end of the year and into 2027. It will be a longish phase of high tension, ratty arguments with eruptions of bad temper.
The Vatican, 7 June 1929, has its Neptune in late Leo also conjunct DT’s Mars so it will be an evasive combatant for him – and a good deal more intelligent. Their Uranus squares his Mercury so will pierce holes in his claims; and their Mars is conjunct his Pluto for implacable opposition. His relationship with the Vatican has been on a slide since the final weeks of Neptune and Saturn in Pisces in January/February of this year – and the second half of this year will see quite a tussle for the upper hand.
I am not normally a great fan of the Vatican but all power to them on this one.
The First Crusade was announced in 1095 with Pluto in early Aries. The last one in 1291 with Pluto in early Aquarius.
Wiki: The siege of Acre (also called the fall of Acre) took place in 1291 and resulted in the Crusaders’ losing control of Acre to the Mamluks. It is considered one of the most important battles of the period. Although the crusading movement continued for several more centuries, the capture of the city marked the end of further crusades to the Levant. When Acre fell, the Crusaders lost their last major stronghold of the Crusader Kingdom of Jerusalem.
ADD ON: J.D.Vance, 2 August 1984 8.11 am Middletown, Ohio, has announced a new memoir centred on his conversion to Catholicism, adding to mounting speculation about a potential 2028 presidential run. Vance converted to Catholicism in 2019 when he was 35, after being raised in a loosely evangelical family. His Catholic conversion has informed his positions on issues such as abortion and family policy, and he has in the past justified the White House’s deportation policies with his interpretation of Catholicism, using ordo amoris – “order of love” – to defend prioritising obligations to fellow citizens over outsiders.
And how is that for timing!
Pope Leo’s Pluto falls on his Ascendant as well Trump’s, so giving the Holy Father the ability to transform Vance’s image – in this instance not for the better, especially since it also squares V’s Mars in Scorpio making for a bitter standoff. The Pope’s Mars in Virgo is conjunct V’s Mercury for arguments; and the Pope’s Neptune is conjunct V’s Pluto as the pontiff’s spiritual status diminishes and confuses V’s power and influence.
Vance’s Neptune in final degree Sagittarius is square Scheat and has been buffeted about by tr Saturn Neptune in square recently. He also has Sedna, the dwarf planet, associated with betrayal and abandonment in his spiritual/religious 9th house.
Vance’s relationship chart with the Pope looks set to rock n’ roll even more as tr Uranus moves into Gemini late this month till mid May and squares the composite Sun – with further nervy interactions across the year end and more chaotic interactions in 2027.
I should point out that Trump posted a picture of himself as the guy the Pope answers to.
Interesting times. Should the pope, any pope, become involved in geopolitics ? Most popes in the 20th century avoided doing so as far as they were able. Pope Leo’s natal Pluto conjunct both the President’s and Vice-President’s Ascendants is extraordinary, it certainly seems significant.
Anyway, US/Iran ceasefire talks are over and have failed, it’s the New Moon on Friday which trines Trump’s and Vance’s Ascendants (also Pope Leo’s Pluto).
As UnMystic Mom has observed, this is “a very interesting religious mixture, very fitting of the late medieval/early modern period.” And the mention of the Avignon Papacy really did seem quite remarkable, here in the 21st century!
The Avignon Papacy is dated to 9th March, 1309 (JC), when Pope Clement V moved to France, one of seven popes who would be very much influenced by France and secular French politics. It’s curious to see the approaching Saturn, Mars, Mercury Aries punch (7 Aries) opposing the Avignon Uranus, 8 Libra, and close to Mercury 10 Aries, and Vatican’s Uranus 10 Aries. What might emerge from this potential shake-up?
Then the 27 Aries New Moon on 17th April, plus Chiron and Eris, opposes the Avignon Neptune, 27 Libra. This seems turbulent yet significant to me, since:
JDVance/Pope Leo Composite: Jupiter 27 Libra – religious leadership seeks balance?
DJT/Pope Leo Composite: Moon 26 Libra, and Uranus at 9 Cancer square the Avignon Uranus in Libra
DJT Solar Arc Neptune 26 Libra, one degree off the Avignon Neptune, 27 Libra
The Moon’s Nodes are currently in Pisces, joining Avignon’s Nodes 10 religious, sacrificial Pisces, and the composite Nodes for both composites mentioned here. Pluto was in Aquarius back in 1309 too.
Amazing how events, including the endless Crusades, can still resonate today.
Interestingly, the man appointed as Cardinal Archbishop of Washington, DC, Robert McElroy, by Pope Francis — though I believe Pope Leo was in charge of screening and recruiting senior prelates and cardinals for Pope Francis — was previously Bishop of San Diego, California, where I live. He’s the perfect person to take on Trump. In San Diego he was known as a progressive bishop, frequently leading or joining protests supporting immigrants and immigrants” rights and opposing Trump’s policies. He also spoke out about cuts to the already American meager social safety net.
I’m not Catholic and am strongly opposed to the Republicans’ imposition of religion in politics, but I really admired Cardinal McElroy’s strong defense of immigrants in our border town and open opposition to Trump’s policies on most fronts. He’s a genuinely good man and the perfect person to appoint as Archbishop of Washington, DC and a great choice to counterbalance Trump’s vileness.
And yes, most Americans are appalled by Paula White, who makes me gag.
Pope Leo and Cardinal McElroy are considerably smarter, more astute and more respected than Trump or Vance. I’d put my money on them to prevail over Trump/Vance.
Thank you for this post, Marjorie, and all the perceptive comments, too!
Interestingly, Pete Hegseth has used a lot of Evangelical Doomsday type rhetoric in his latest press conferences. It seems that this might have been too scary even for Trump, who, notably, has been seen at any church or religious function only when it’s about ceremony. Hegseth is a 29′ Pisces Moon and has 4′ Aries IC. I think he might well be the next to go from Trump Administration, mostly because they need to pin the Iran disaster on someone, but also because he comes across as a true zealot.
I think we are living in interesting times now, Pope Leo has always not been happy about the war in Iran, in one article that I read last week he says “American people must contact thier representatives now, it’s time” what he means literally is that the Americans must move to remove Trump from office. It looks like almost everyone in the US including his staunch MAGA supporters are not happy with the Iran war, Ticket Carlson, Andy Jones, Candace Owens to name a few have criticised him publicly. In one of her posts Candace wrote “It’s time we put grandpa in a home now” referring to Trump. Trump responded by lashing out at them calling them people who need psychiatric help like Iran. Trump’s support has eroded a lot, it’s strange he is still in office.
One Dr Bob Pfalzgraf, an associate medical examiner for Jacksonville’s Duval County, wrote in his X post that “I am looking forward to a Big Beautiful Obituary” and he was immediately suspended after the post, it appears he knows a lot about Trump’s health. Astrologically Trump is hanging by a threads now, he can fall any time. Before he took office, astrology did indicate that he is not going to finish his term in office.
Tshele, I do not mean to be supportive of DJT in any way and I sympathize, but based on my view of the astrology, it is a mistake to say Trump is hanging by a thread and can fall any time. He may be ill, he may be nuts, he may be an utter disaster, but his strong natal fixed angles, Jupiter/Uranus trine, and mutual reception by exaltation between natal Saturn and Jupiter say he’s tougher than most. Also, his progressed Venus/Jupiter conjunction is still exact, as well as trine his progressed Uranus. His progressed Moon in Scorpio is still trine his natal Venus, though the p. Moon is moving to square his natal Mars in Leo – which can go either way in expression. It may mean his p. Moon will express his aggressive Mars nature even more dramatically than before. Transiting Chiron in his 9th of foreign affairs (wars) is applying to trine his natal Mars at 26 Leo – note, it is a trine, not a square.
The astrology looks like more aggression to me. It may be a horrible disaster for the country and the world, but fixed signs and trines indicate he will stick to his so-called plan and he won’t bother with the consequences as he is doing what he wants (trine). Also, transiting Pluto in Aquarius may be in his 6th, but it is still in orb of a T-square to progressed Ascendant in Scorpio and opposition to natal Pluto in Leo in his 12th, along with progressed MC and Saturn also in Leo in the 12th. Those fixed points of the T indicate a power pattern that does not break easily or for a while yet.
Popular or not, and sick or well, he is built to hang in for the long run. Which means his administration is probably using him as the front man for their backroom purposes (all those planets in the 12th) while other players work desperately to do an end run around him and prevent more disasters. But they are not running the show freely in the existing US political structure because he is THE president. Trump rants on, but it doesn’t mean he’s actually going anywhere. I don’t see Vance or anyone stepping into his shoes. It even looks doubtful that anybody can work things effectively or influence him behind the scenes when transiting Saturn (delays) in Aries (aggression) in his 8th opposes his progressed Neptune (evasion) at 7 Libra (negotiations/indecision) in his 2nd of personal wealth. What a dog’s breakfast that is. Sorry, that’s how I see it – we can dream on all we like, but the world is stuck with him, imo.
Thank-you Sweetgrass.
Terrific assessment IMO.
My mother was exactly like Trump… exactly. The only difference was her lesser power! She was the Master of manipulation, chaos, creating allies, then breaking them, pitting people against each other, lying. She was never diagnosed or medicated.
I’ve only met one other person like her, and I’ve met a LOT of people.
As Trump became bolder, my husband commented on the similarities. From the start, he would describe her to other people as “Gollum” from Lord of the Rings.
“I want the ring!”
The ONLY way to deal with her was to not play her games… to look her in the eye and say, “that’s another game Mom”. She never took it personally….. she’d have a kind of smirking smile.. and then come up with another game, another angle. She never, ever, ever changed. She died with zero remorse for the harm she caused.
So these last years I’ve watched people go on and on about Trump… believe what he says, not believe what he says. I’ve watched the media play along reporting every last thing about his actions and words. That only feeds a person like this! They are empty inside and so need that outer chaos and attention to know they exist.
On the other hand, my Mom was also easily manipulated! And so, as you say, I am convinced that the “other players” in the administration and beyond, are using Trump for their own gain…. a dangerous game for sure, because he still is unpredictable. I’ve always thought that the media ought to focus way, way more on these other players rather than Trump.
How interesting to see all those astrological fixed points and the strong transits. Like my Mom, Trump is definitely “built to hang in for the long run.”. Mom finally just wore out at age 90, sharp as a tack and manipulating all around her right to the end.
She was my greatest teacher and it shows up strongly in my chart.
thanks for this Sweetgrass…. a “dog’s breakfast” indeed.
Thanks for the further comments, Sandra. I wish I’d thought of ‘sweetgrass’ as a moniker since it’s used for sacred medicinal practises, but mine was just cobbled together on impulse when I first commented. There is not much sweet stuff these days, sad to say.
As for your insight, your description appears apt for the personality syndrome DJT displays. We all have our flaws and quirks, but DJT seems to operate on a different plane altogether. I have never known anyone like him personally (and lucky not to). It is shocking that such a rare personality type (assuming it’s rare) should acquire so much power and influence as to threaten the entire world order.
Your point about the media playing along and him being empty, too, does fit a gollum-like figure who brings out the greed in everyone around him, along with his own greed. If he is empty inside, he must be extra hungry for attention, money and power. How that happens society-wide, as well as to the person himself, is beyond me, but it is scary stuff. People should wake up soon from the spell he casts. However, principles of astrology imply it goes on until its “time is up”. Not a comforting thought.
I think in many ways his malignant narcissism is so overt, it is showing/teaching the world exactly what malignant narcissism looks like and how it works. I also wonder to what extent his diehard supporters and base also experienced a narcissistic or abusive father or parent, but rather than seek healing from their childhood trauma, absorb and repeat it, hoping perhaps for the approval they never received as children with their interactions with Trump. Just a thought.
It’s worth remembering that Eris/Chiron is now square his Venus/Saturn – and Gnarly Dude has pinpointed his Venus/Saturn in Cancer as the weak point of his chart, which the more I think about, the more it makes absolute sense.
I don’t think he will last the full term either, but who knows? Excessively malignant individuals seem to thrive in their malignancy, as if it is their very driving force. But his mental state will only deteriorate more and more as time goes on.
Hello. My mother is just like him. Her vocabulary is so similar to his, it’s uncanny. She even uses the same intonations. She’s his biggest fan. He can never fail and can only be failed. I think she’s borderline-Scorpio sun in 8th, Aries ASC, Taurus moon. Her brother is 14 years younger than her and is a psychopath or sociopath. He’s also similar to Trump, in that, spending time around him is disorienting and disregulating. He’s early degree Libra, born in 1953. A lot now happening to folks born that year. His kids are estranged from him and probably will never reconnect.
Yes, I hear you Sweetgrapes. But as astrologers we have our own way of reading or interpreting birth charts the same, even students from Universities learn from the same book or are taught by the same professor, but they don’t learn the same, even after graduating and become professionals like doctors or architects, they don’t work or design the buildings that look the same. By that I mean with respect, that’s how you see things, and that’s how I see things. You might be right or may be wrong, or vice versa. But honestly I still don’t see Trump reaching 2028, the end of his term in office. In simple terms, if Trump is till in office at the end of his term in 2028, you were right. If he is gone before then, I was right. Let’s wait for the verdict.
Tshele, you are quite right! We wait. The astrology will prove out one way or another. LOL!
This Pope is smart and not interested in being Vance’s (or Trump’s) spiritual side piece. Good for him.
It is indeed an interesting if not bizarre mix. The US religious right consists primarily of Protestants (with their evangelical leaders), and to a much lesser extent Catholics, some with Irish origins, most nowadays with Latin American roots without necessarily being ‘MAGA’ but voting Trump on religious grounds. The latter has certainly become disillusioned (as if they weren’t warned) with the deportations. Catholics historically did not have a big influence in American politics – JFK was a big deal at the time for both being young and especially Catholic.
It’s the same large cohort of the religious Protestant right who believes in the End Times.
The nation was in large part founded on fleeing religious persecution in England, so of course they will come to eventually perpetuate it to some extent in their new country. There is supposed to be a separation of church and state, yet we sing ‘God bless America’ and our currency states ‘In God we trust’. Just part of many contradictions.
It’s been many years since the mostly Protestant MAGA has been claiming that Trump is the new ‘Savior’, which Trump then encourages to the point where he may actually believe it. But since he doesn’t actually believe in anything, he will seize whatever suits him – in this case, the Avignon Pope even though he is a (nominally) Protestant.
He probably even delights in the idea that he could be the Pope, or better yet, the one multi-denominational religious leader (almost God, to lead the ultimate realm as he has been openly pondering his legacy and the afterlife – maybe that explains his praise of Allah on Easter Sunday …). That the actual Pope is American is one more reason to somehow outrank him.
In his book, ‘Fantasyland: How America Went Haywire: A 500-Year History’ (2017), Kurt Andersen examines America’s Protestant roots, its history of tolerance for magical thinking and extreme religious fervour, its propensity for dramatic and performative displays of zeal – despite being specifically forbidden by Christ in Matthew 6:5 – and the principle that individuals possessed both the privilege and obligation to personally interpret the Bible, independent of the Catholic Church’s authority.
As a result, a multitude of sects arose, each with their own unique interpretations of scripture. The individualized approach to spirituality in the United States was fertile ground for individuals embracing a diverse array of beliefs, which in turn facilitated the rise of religious movements often marked by nontraditional ideas – from Calvinism to Mormonism, from Mormonism to Scientology and so on. The blurring of fact and fiction in America’s religious landscape, he argues bleeds into the overall culture, into the very fabric of policymaking.
He also examines the increasing inclusion of fantastical components into the realms of politics and government administration, the growing inclination among Republicans to adopt conspiracy theories, the spread of unfounded allegations about election fraud, vaccination programs, extreme skepticism about climate change and the global organization’s sustainability program, all highlight the damaging influence that radical conservative beliefs exert on the policy-making of the Republican Party. The book was written in 2017, during Trump’s 1st term, and here we are almost a decade on in an even worse mess.
Any non-American who has seen the excessive religiosity of Trump’s spiritual advisor, Paula White – who btw speaks in tongues, yet another peculiarly of American evangelism as well as Pentecostalism – would find such displays embarrassing to be around. The fact that she repeatedly likens Trump to Christ is not only wishful thinking, but infantile to a worrying degree.
I should add, I’m sure there are plenty of Americans who find Paula White nauseating too.
To be fair there are plenty of pacifist Protestant sects such as Quakers, Amish, Hutterites, Christadelphians etc. The idea that wars need to be justified is derived from St Augustine who is a major influence on both Catholic and Protestant religious thinking. Christian Zionism has its origin among 17th century English Puritans around the time of the Thirty Years War when people across Europe thought they were living at the end of the world.
Millenarianism is not a strictly Protestant phenomenon as there were a number of examples in the Catholic Middle Ages. There are similar Messianic beliefs in Judaism and Islam. Many Shia Muslims in Iran believe in the return of the Twelfth Imam, Muhammed al/Mahdi at the end of time introducing a world of peace and justice.
I wouldn’t even attempt to not acknowledge the important contributions made by, for example Quakerism, Hugh as there is no doubt that it was – in the UK at least – instrumental in bringing about important reforms and welfare, not to mention the business models they set up – Rountree, Bounville, Cadbury, etc. And of course I’m aware of the eschatology of this other faiths – even Buddhism has the ‘Maitreya’, the fifth Buddha, who will appear on earth to deliver the dharma to humanity in order to release it from samsara.
But something has gone very wrong with the many strands of Protestantism and other offshoots of Christianity in America. It gives rise to the proliferation of unhealthy cults and cult-like mentality, a phenomenon which we have seen in MAGA itself. It’s a blessing afaiac that in the UK we have a fairly skeptical approach to religiosity and simply do not tolerate loud displays of zealotry and proclaimations of faith.
No need to go back to the Middle Ages to see Catholic Wackos. Just go onto Youtube and scroll. You will see many sites describing visions of the Virgin Mary warning us of the immanent arrival of the ‘Great Chastisement’
Oh the BVM pops up everywhere, warning of the end times! Quite a busy lady.
This is a…pardon the pun…come to Jesus moment for American Catholics. Trump won the vote in two of the three elections in which he was a candidate. Despite Trump’s blatant immoral indiscretions. Now there’s a line in the sand. Hope the Vatican wins out.
Thank you for this post, Marjorie.
It was with some shock that the world realised that there is at least somebody in the current US administration who has read about the Avignon Papacy and who threatened the current Pope with it.
The Avignon Papacy occurred in the Middle Ages when the French king managed to get a French cardinal elected as Pope. That Pope, French in origin, then moved the Papacy from Rome to Avignon in southern France and he and the subsequent popes were then, for a while, mostly French puppets. Towards the end, rival popes were elected in both Rome and Avignon. That Papacy ended in a threeway schism in the church, with multiple councils held to try to resolve the situation.
Perhaps Trump/his acolytes is threatening to hold the Pope hostage in the US if he ever visits the US.
In a rebuke to Trump, I believe that Pope Leo IV has announced that on July 4th 2026, the US’s 250th birthday, he, the American Pope, will be on the Italian island of Lampedusa (there must be some mirth in the last three letters of that island’s name) with refugees from Africa.
It is interesting to see the overtly religious conflicts between various sides of Trump’s circle. Apparently, Catholic members of the US armed forces were expressly disinvited from religious events organised by the armed forces for Good Friday. Conversely, of course, the Vice-President of the United States talks about his Catholic faith and conversion.
And that is before we even factor in Trump’s remarkable message on Easter day that ended with praise to the deity of another Abrahamic faith altogether.
A very interesting religious mixture, very fitting of the late medieval/early modern period.
I should have added that apparently Catholic members of the US armed forces were disinvited from religious events organised by the armed forces for Good Friday, on Pete Hegseth’s express instructions.
Thanks, Marjorie. Can you also add JD Vance who was baptized Catholic reportedly on August 11, 2019? He recently wrote a book about his conversion, which is being released in June – rather awkward time given the current news about Trump’s threats to the Pope and the Vatican (although by then who knows what the latest outrage will be). I recall Pope Francis correcting Vance’s interpretation of who Catholics should care about in order of rank! Anyway, Pope Leo is said to have decided not to visit the US this year and will be elsewhere on the July 4th 250th Independence anniversary.