There is an outpouring of appreciation for the Queen as the Jubilee celebrations draw huge crowds and much local partying. Behind the good feelings there is also a sadness that the days of her reign are coming to a close. She’s gradually handing over the public ceremonies of state to Charles, though by all accounts is not letting go of the red boxes which tie her into a monarch’s daily perusal of political and global events.
While in no way wishing to hasten her exit I wondered if her accession chart should throw up any clues to a future handover as Queen Victoria and Elizabeth 1’s did.
Elizabeth 1 was handed the sceptre (metaphorically speaking) on 17 November 1558 on Mary’s death. The coronation took place two months later. When Elizabeth died on 24 March 1603, the Accession chart was showing distinct tremors with an undermining Solar Arc Mars closely opposition the Neptune; Solar Arc Neptune was also square the Mars; tr Saturn was conjunct the Sun and tr Uranus opposition the Uranus.
Queen Victoria acceded on 20 June 1837 on the death of William IV with the coronation a year later. When she died Solar Arc Mars was conjunct the Accession Saturn exactly; with tr Neptune conjunct the Sun.
The Queen’s Accession chart, 6 February 1952, has no dramatic Solar Arcs in the immediate future. Solar Arc Mars will square the Neptune in 2027 when she will be 101 and matching her mother’s longevity; and Solar Arc Pluto will conjunct the Mars by 2028.
There is a shift this year and next as tr Uranus, preceded by tr Saturn hits on the central Aquarius Sun opposition Pluto – so there will be significant changes. But nothing like as dramatic as was showing for either Elizabeth 1 or Victoria.
Life in the UK will not be the same.
The UK has a Parliamentary system. We don’t elect a president, like they do in the USA, or do what some other countries do, have a combination of the two.
Most of the time with a change in PM a general election is usually called within a short period of time. Though I seem to remember Gordon Brown taking a very long time before he was persuaded to.
Until recently, the PM could call for a general election any time he or she wanted to. Margaret Thatcher was famous for it. David Cameron changed the rules and that meant that it had to be every five years unless the house of commons agreed.to hold a general election. I don’t recall them ever saying no.
The beautiful Caribbean? Has anyone noticed the growing influence of Russia and China in that area and the interests of some of the local elites, truth is the West can do more in the way of investment, neglecting those areas has opened the way to other players, just follow the money.
Yes, you are right Virginia, and Africa too (mainly the black countries and esp Africa, particularly annihilated and disseminated because of slavery (physically and mentally especially).
The other end of the thinking is that Russia and China isn’t doing anything that the ‘West’ hasn’t/isn’t doing. Just doing it with a different narrative. It’s always been about money. Then and now. ‘The West’ had their day and now R and C are trying to have theirs. The real crux is the people trying to obtain autonomy to fail or succeed, at least they are trying. Whether it takes a Republic or not, etc. And it goes on. If anything support through expertise, best practice, etc, from the West could assist in the form of education. Food for a thought or two!
Yes democracy is a messy business. But I still think it is a worthwhile endeavour. But nobody is held to account for what their ancestors did hundreds of years ago.. And remember The Commonwealth was invented as something positive rather than some sort of shackles designed to keep people in their place.
If the people want to leave, then so be it. But denying them that right is disgraceful. And if they have to have a president, it shouldn’t be just given to somebody who has flagrantly disregarded their duties and ignored the basic tenets of democracy, which is that the people decide.
Thanks for your thoughts Linda, interesting
‘Yes democracy is a messy business. But I still think it is a worthwhile endeavour.’
For me, that goes without saying. I don’t know any other way to live. I can/have only come to an assumption about the other way based on other people’s accounts, etc. #
‘And remember The Commonwealth was invented as something positive …’
Exactly why even if Caribbean countries become a Republic they can still be a part of the Commonwealth. Canada is part of the Commonwealth! Are they still owned by ‘the Queen’?
‘denying them that right’ do you mean denying them the right to stay under the Queen?
‘And if they have to have a president, it shouldn’t be just given to somebody who has flagrantly disregarded their duties and ignored the basic tenets of democracy, which is that the people decide.’
I guess there is a process, just like in the UK? So the people will decide at an/the election? If there is a discrepancy there when it comes, then we can make all the assumptions you are making. But until then….
BTW, when David Cameron jumped ship did the people elect Theresa May? Or when Theresa May jumped ship or was pushed did the people elect Boris Johnson? (Yes, I know they then elected him at the General Election). Just checking.
Those countries in the Carribean that have left us, did so without referendums. Trinidad and Tobago decided that the referendum they held caused too much dissent. These particular countries decided that they didn’t need the permission of their electorate and went ahead anyway.
Barbados did what I suspect the others did. The Governor General was one minute the Governor General, the next minute she is President until they decide to hold elections. The Governor General is supposed to be the Queen’s Representative. It is an appointed position and supposed to be non-political. So yes it matters. Unless you are in favour of dictatorships!
As for the rest, they are in the position of having to have 2 thirds of their parliaments vote it through as well as a referendum of the electorate. They are currently in the stages of looking for ways to do without the inconvenience of asking the electorate’s permission because democracy is so inconvenient!
As for a referendum I concede that hasn’t happened but would put money on it that most people except the old schoolers, i.e. maybe 65 upwards, no longer see the link with the Queen anymore. I could on. Dictatorship is a strong word and we don’t have a strong constitution for such, so very much doubt it will go down that road. Tourism is the top earner for most of these countries so that wouldn’t make sense would it. I don’t think we are that stupid whatever you may think. And if we are let’s make our own mistakes.
Whilst in principle a referendum works in a democracy, look what it’s done for the UK recently
I think people of the Caribbean will figure it out as part of our evolution in the long run. We can’t always be under the skirt tail of our ‘mother country ‘ . We have to grow up and take responsibility for good or ill sooner or later.
Now if you’re mourning that you’re losing the last remnants of the Queen’s empire, that’s a whole other story that brings up subjects the Queen nor her Parliament wants to deal with today like it’s history of brutality and breeding farms for slaves in the Caribbean, now reparations etc. So she’s probably glad to close certain doors methinks.
Marjorie, why has the Queen continued to ignore the fact that so many governor generals are not representing her as they should, but actively seek a repuplican platform. This is not what they are supposed to be doing at all! We have lost nearly half the Carribean. I thought the monarchy wanted the commonwealth.
Hmm…..! Not even sure what ‘We have lost nearly half the Carribean’ means (so I’ll ignore that), but if those that see fit want to become a Republic shouldn’t they be entitled to? The Republics by way of respect to the Queen are still/can still remain within the Commonwealth, just no longer owned by the Queen. Barbados who became a Republic recently still remain in the Commonwealth despite becoming a republic.
*Caribbean
I meant to put Edward viii.
Edward vi abdicating was like a nail in the coffin for George vi and the Queen. Of course they would do their utmost to counteract that. Which of course means pledging your life to serving the UK and the Commonwealth. After 70 years, she deserves more respect, than has been given. Especially from a certain person who continually talks about reparation while ignoring her own family’s continued slave trade dealing in Nigeria, which is nothing to do with the Queen or the UK,
Although as an American I don’t see the need for royalty at all, throughout my lifetime I’ve always been impressed at your Queen’s dedication to the elegant formalities that represent the state and institutions and provide a positive focal point for the public’s good will. Nobody else will ever hold a candle to that in the rest of my lifetime, I do believe. Charles may be able to properly show up without putting foot into mouth ceremonially, but I can’t see him ever being the centre of so much appreciative respect and caring as the Queen has gained.
Based on the Queen Mother’s 101 years and Philip reaching nearly 100, I assumed the Queen would reign for several more years. But there appears to have been a dramatic decline in the Queen’s physical appearance in the past 18 months. She looks very unwell – more than extreme old age. Looking at Princess Anne’s chart, her progressed Sun is 2 Scorpio (conjunct her natal Mars) and will pick up the October eclipse at 2 Scorpio. Significantly Anne’s SA Moon is at 24 Scorpio which is approaching the Queens natal Saturn (and the Queen’s MC shortly after), all of which is activated by May’s lunar eclipse at 25 Scorpio. (As is Anne’s SA Chiron at 25 Aquarius). Anne has natal Moon in Virgo, ruled by Mercury which has progressed to 28 Libra in her chart. This is being squared by transiting Pluto (in her third house of siblings – Andrew’s shenanigans). Her progressed Mercury (ruler of her Moon) is currently conjunct her SA Pluto at 28 Libra.
The Queen has been around for so long, it will be a huge shock to the UK and the world as she is an Icon. The Times did an article about how the world press reacted, with Spain being very complimentary about her. On another note. The Horses were fabulously presented, the work which must have gone into this years Trooping of the Colour paid off, as it was resplendent.
Hello Gnarly Dude,
Louis 14 was king of France between 1643 and 1715. He was succeeded by his great grandson, Louis 15, who was then king between 1715 and 1774.
During the French Revolution, the king was then Louis 16.
That’s the ones, thank-you Elisabeth for tidying up the details. The idea of having two rulers in 130+ years amazes me!
If, indeed, she does match her mother’s longevity and does not abdicate (both quite possible), then another astrologer’s prediction from some decades ago that Charles may never become King could turn out to be accurate.
Far from being quite possible, the Queen’s abdication is a remote possibility. Her father, George VI, inculcated in her his belief that being the monarch was not a job to be done, but a life long contract between the monarch and the country that only ends with the death of the monarch. British monarchs are anointed at their Coronation to symbolise the binding nature of this.
Two quotes by Queen Elizabeth II.
On her 21st Birthday in 1947.
I declare before you all that my whole life whether it be long or short shall be devoted to your service and the service of our great imperial family to which we all belong.
On her accession to the throne in 1952.
‘By the sudden death of my dear father I am called to assume the duties and responsibilities of sovereignty. My heart is too full for me to say more to you today than I shall always work as my father did throughout his reign, to advance the happiness and prosperity of my peoples, spread as they are all the world over.’
Those are the words of someone who fully understands that becoming Queen imposes upon her duties which will last for her lifetime.
Unless Charles predeceases his mother, he will automatically become King. That is how monarchy works. Of course he may choose not to be crowned – especially if both he and Camilla are nearing 80 at the time.
FWIW – I was looking at the list of longest reigning monarchs a couple of months ago.
Without checking, she is about to pass the King of Thailand (for 2nd place), who was something like 70yrs, 120 days. I believe The Queen may actually have surpassed it as she started her reign in the early February.
The longest reigning monarch was the French king who reigned from 1649 – 1711 (72+ yrs). He was succeeded by his son who reigned 58yrs until the French Revolution in 1789! Imagine having only two monarchs in 130 yrs!!
That was meant to be a reply to Jane’s comment.
I thought Louis was a star and his interactions with Charlotte wonderfully entertaining – both children seem full of character!
@Virgoflake, yes, it’s great to see kids being still kids! Charlotte also still looks a lot like her great grandmother as a child, and Louis like greatuncle Edward.
Louis was certainly the side attraction. Was trying to remember his chart – I think he has Sun-Uranus conjunction perhaps explaining his rebellion against the formality.
On a slightly dark note, as the planes came up the Mall, it occurred to me that were there to be a 9-11 moment into the balcony then Harry would be taking over!!
I hope that the Queen lives long enough for there to be a 75th anniversary to the start of her reign, which she will if she lives as long as her mother. Indeed, perhaps we should put the Queen on a gin-and-Dubonnet diet, as it seems to have preserved her mother past her own century.
That would make Charles (possibly George VII?) 78 years at the earliest before he comes to the Throne.
I was at work in central London yesterday (somebody’s got to keep the lights on and the systems working), but my colleagues and I popped out to see the flypast, which was grand. Also, the energy of so many people being convivial and enjoying themselves in the lovely weather was wonderful. It was a welcome relief of the self-isolation of and a collective good-riddance to the past two years.
Much has happened in the Queen’s reign that we have to be thankful for. Even if she obviously did not have any part to play in most of it, she is a physical embodiment (literally) of a bygone era and the change that many of us are living through and are lucky enough to experience.
As Winston Churchill had said, we are lucky to have lived through the second Elizabethan era.
Thanks Marjorie. Life in the UK will certainly not be the same, as you say. The Queen has always been there as a figurehead for most of us, whatever stage of life we’re at – a point of symbolic stability whatever one’s personal feelings about the monarchy. The only point of comparison I can think of is the late King of Thailand, who was much loved, and reigned for 70 years.
I noticed that the UK 1801’s Venus in Aquarius is conjunct the 16 Aquarius Sun of the Accession chart – perfect for the woman who has represented the UK for so long. Then, in November, the Lunar Eclipse at 16 Taurus squares those. Really underlines what you write:
“There is a shift this year and next as tr Uranus, preceded by tr Saturn hits on the central Aquarius Sun opposition Pluto – so there will be significant changes.”
I also noticed that the October Solar Eclipse at 2 Scorpio will oppose Prince Charles’ Moon (0 Taurus) and North Node (3 Taurus) – a focus on mother, women, the people, destiny…. At the same time, it is conjunct Prince William’s MC (2 Scorpio) and Jupiter (0 Scorpio). It squares the UK’s own regal Jupiter at 1.51 Leo in the 10th house. William’s role accelerates further, towards his becoming King, eventually? Tr Pluto just into Aquarius will nudge all of those degrees next spring. “Significant changes” indeed.
A PS, re the eclipses and Pluto:
Princess Anne: Mars 2 Scorpio, MC 3 Leo
Prince Edward: Venus 3 Taurus, Neptune 17 Scorpio
Harry, Duke of Sussex: Pluto 0 Scorpio, MC 17 Scorpio
Prince Andrew (if I must!): Moon 25 Scorpio, Neptune 9 Scorpio, Uranus 18 Leo – his chart was activated by the April and May eclipses we’ve just had.
And UM – We saw some of the flypast planes on their way to central London yesterday. The atmosphere was uplifting everywhere, very much needed. I had some nostalgic thoughts about the energy of the Olympic summer too.