Mary Tyler Moore – tossed out sugar and spice for freedom

Mary Tyler Moore, known as America’s sweetheart, was a fixture on television in the 1960s/1970s, who morphed from being Dick van Dyke’s stylish wife on screen to being a single,  independent woman in her own show. She “helped define a new vision of American womanhood” who had careers and could stand on their own two feet. The show faced issues such as equal pay, birth control, and sexual independence and that was in the 1970s.

“Just because you have a smile on your face doesn’t mean doesn’t mean you are not ready to go into battle.”

  She had a drama-filled and in many ways tragic life which belied her chirpy onscreen persona. Both her parents were alcoholic and she elected in childhood to live with an aunt and see her parents rarely. A younger sister died of painkillers and alcohol aged 21; her only son died from a gun accident aged 24 and her brother died in his late 40s from cancer.  She herself suffered from diabetes and she was alcoholic for many years, as was Dick van Dyke.

  Her chart certainly reflects a life that was turbulent and high-risk as well as lucky and successful. She was born 29 December 1936 at 10.45am in Brooklyn, New York which gave her a fortunate Sun Jupiter in Capricorn in her 10th house of career so there was no doubt she was heading for glory and triumphs despite her unlikely beginnings. She had an attention-demanding Moon Pluto in Cancer in her performing 5th house opposition Mercury and square an 8th house Mars. She was do-or-die determined with a hefty dose of ancestral grit and anger pushing her on.

  She had the creative Saturn in Pisces opposition Neptune of the mid 1930s squaring onto a 10th house North Node so career would always come more easily than settling into domestic contentment.

 The death of her son hit her hard not surprisingly and her chart was in shock – tr Pluto was on the cusp of her 8th house. Tr Neptune was conjunct her Midheaven. Solar Arc Uranus was conjunct her IC and her Solar Arc Pluto was conjunct her Descendant. The axis of her world was rocked. And in that oddly spooky way, with an 8th house planet involved, it occurred less than a month after the Robert Redford directed movie Ordinary People was released in which she played a mother who was grieving over the accidental death of her son.

   She did key into the USA chart with her Mercury opposition Pluto Moon facing up to the USA’s Mercury opposition Pluto in Capricorn as she highlighted controversial and divisive issues.

  Quite a lady, who died finally in 2017.

12 thoughts on “Mary Tyler Moore – tossed out sugar and spice for freedom

  1. MTM’s performance in the film, ‘Ordinary People’ (she was nominated for an Oscar) as a bereaved narcissistic mother who has lost her ‘golden child’ is outstanding and I would recommend anyone to watch the film, though it’s an incredibly painful watch since one sees it through the eyes of the ‘second-best’/scapegoat son who had attempted suicide in the aftermath. His inability to reach his mother, who psychologically punishes her surviving son is gruelling but perfectly nuanced and gut wrenching.

    I didn’t know that TM sadly lost her own son following the making of the film.

    • It was such a powerful brilliant performance. I don’t think I could ever watch it again, though. I was the scapegoat and my brother is the golden child so that’s probably a factor with how that film blew me away. I also grew up very near where it was filmed and frequented the restaurant wherein the scene with Hutton and his friend from psych ward was filmed. It’s a hugely popular restaurant so I have local, tangible connections to the film, as well. I have always said that my narcissistic mother is a combination of the MTM character from this film, the Mrs. Bennett character from Pride and Prejudice and the Annette Bening character from American Beauty. My mother is a double Scorpio with Taurus Moon—very intense. My brother, the golden child, has severe mental illness and can’t function on his own. My mother has told this to no one, not even her closest and most trusted relatives. Instead, she has lied and has said that he’s a hugely successful entrepreneur and independently wealthy. Textbook fixed sign, I guess.

      • Thank you, Aim. I’m not surprised the film must have been an uncomfortable experience for you. For me, it relates to my father’s inability to show any kind of emotional connection with me despite my mother’s attempts to encourage him to do so, which almost made it worse. (I have Sun square Saturn). As a child, I was invisible to him. Over the years, I have come to understand that he was almost certainly somewhere on the autistic spectrum and that in his own way, he did love me. But a narcissistic parent can wreak such destruction on the family. I knew a family similar to yours from childhood onwards, with the mother as the narcissist and father as enabler. She terrorised her children, was pathologically competitive, religious too as a pillar of the church and the ‘golden child’ did not thrive because they simply could not live up to her grandiose expectations. They dropped out of college and became addicted to class As which destroyed their health with Hepatitis and died prematurely. I myself was scapegoated by this woman for a while, so I can only imagine the psychological toll on the others, 24/7. Ironically, the child she criticised the most was the one who went on to be highly successful and is the most grounded.

  2. Apropos of nothing astrological, when I was a kid, every one of my middleclass schoolfriends birthday parties for some reason had a shaky screening of Thoroughly Modern Milie. Every single one!
    She was fried into my brain along with Carol Channing and her spider eyelashes shagging everything that moved.
    Utterly bizarre film, highly entertaining the first 3 times…they dont make them like that anymore…

  3. Is there anything in charts that indicates the impact of trauma on the rest of a person’s life & their personality? How people react to set-backs?

    By which I mean that some people cant get past it & it becomes their whole being & personality, to their detriment (Prince Harry!). Others are resilient, and while they may not forget or forgive, it can almost be a driver to success.

    I’ve read many posts on this site where people have had the most appalling tragedy in their lifes, yet they have been able to not let it overwhelm them and it makes them intead of breaking them, which is impressive.

    • Hi Belle, I would be curious to know this also. I wonder if a strong Mars can help – for instance Scorpio or Aries? Maybe Cardinal planets or points on a birth chart and/or fire planets which can provide positivity in the face of adversity. Fixed planets which can give stubbornness and/or mutable planets for adaptability?

      I’m not sure if people get over trauma. I think it’s more about managing and coping with it. I consider myself to be both overwhelmed and resilient (although I don’t like the word resilient) with my life experience. I think the fixed planets I have have helped with persistence, along with a Saturn trine Sun, Mercury and Jupiter (all fire signs). I’m still broken, but still fighting – Mars in Scorpio, perhaps helps with this.

      If I remember rightly, Kurt Cobain had no fire planets on his chart & this meant that he could get overwhelmed without having the use of fire planets to bring some relief.

      Also, I think a lot of women who are parents have the impetus to remain ‘strong’ for their children. I imagine Mary Tyler Moore was absolutely broken when her son passed away.

      Hopefully others will respond to your question because I’m no expert & would like to hear what others have to say.

    • It may well be a mix of factors. Top of the list would probably be a prominent Jupiter which brings luck and a (crazy) optimism that there has to be better round the next corner. And does actually bring good fortune and lucky breaks which can balance out the bleakness.
      A heavy dose of Cardinal signs (Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn) probably also helps since they give initiative and the start-again factor. This not working? Pull up roots and reboot. Aries is superb at that.
      Fixed signs give perseverance and endurance but sometimes mean a bad situation is stuck with rather than moving on.
      Water signs find letting the past go difficult – Cancer especially, and vengeful Scorpio and regretful Pisces – and that would include planets in their natural homes – 4th, 8th and 12th houses.
      There is also that mysterious X factor which a birth chart won’t tell you – which is to do with levels of evolution. It’s a concept I am uneasy about but the ‘old souls’ notion that some come into this lifetime with more innate knowledge than others may help in gaining awareness and giving choices that are denied to ‘younger’ souls. Insight and acceptance would seem to be the key.

      • Thank you Marjorie for your insights on these issues of resilience and the ability to 1.accept, 2. learn from, and 3. move on from painful experiences. I have a very fixed chart – a lot of fire, water, minimal earth and air. Being introduced to ideas about the North and South nodes really helped me to shift my thinking, especially when I get stuck trying to use the same old remedies that no longer work. Leaning into my Libra NN has rescued me from all sorts of Aries inspired fighting. My NN is very much towards the end of my 12th house, so it’s not the easiest energy to access, but it’s conjunct my Jupiter and I believe this awareness helps.

      • I am very grateful for my Scorpio Mars, my Cardinal Sun square Saturn and Pluto rising. Perhaps a gross generalisation, but in my own family I have found that strongly mutable charts are more susceptible to psychological collapse, certainly the case wth my grandfather’s 7 mutable planet chart.

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