Keir Starmer has hit the ground running or tripping himself up depending on one’s viewpoint. Since politics in the moment is as much about perception as policies, there is a slight sense of a tone-deaf administration picking the wrong fights however sanctimonious the reasons behind their decisions. None is weirder (though admittedly trivial) than the decision to remove from the No 10 study the portrait of Maggie Thatcher, whom Starmer had previously praised and had been commissioned by Gordon Brown, because he found it “unsettling”. It was rehung elsewhere.
What both Maggie and Starmer share is a prominent Jupiter opposition Pluto = super-confident, power hungry, good leadership material but tending to assume rules don’t apply to them. It also leads to oneupmanship tussles for the upper hand and last word. Maybe he thought she was glaring down at him, trying to outshine his achievements. Their charts in an odd way are fairly similar since she had her Sun and Mars tied into Jupiter Pluto. While Starmer has his Sun tied into Pluto and Jupiter.
Starmer’s Uranus is conjunct Maggie’s Sun and his Sun Pluto falls in her 10th – so if she was alive he would be determined to keep her under control. His Libra Moon clashes with her Mars in Libra square Pluto and Jupiter so he would in the flesh have found her overwhelming. His prominent Neptune (in a Water Grand Trine) is conjunct her Saturn in Scorpio on her Ascendant – which may be a large part of the problem. Sakoian & Acker remark: “The individuals can have an oppressive or depressing influence on each other.”
Their relationship chart has the signature composite Jupiter opposition Pluto; with the composite Sun conjunct Neptune square Saturn engendering doubt and suspicion; plus a gritty, aggravated composite Saturn trine Mars.
What is intriguing about Starmer’s chart is the close Jupiter Chiron conjunction opposition Sun Pluto.
Jupiter Chiron can hint at messianic tendencies, the impulse to follow a vision. And it can suggest a wound to a sense of hope, confidence and optimism.
Pluto Chiron suggests the wound centres around power and powerlessness, gives an attraction to danger and darkness which his legal work would certainly fulfil; and can bring a fear of death.
Sun Chiron can be afraid to shine as a personality.
He was such an odd colourless personality before stepping up – with no birth time but Neptune on a Scorpio Ascendant for a 12 noon birth looks feasible. A self-protective, private, creative though not always realistic Water Grand Trine channeling its energy into that reforming and very, very determined (and power hungry) Sun Pluto (Uranus) opposition Jupiter Chiron. More will no doubt emerge.
I wish Sue Gray would admit to a birth date – September 1957 is all that is known so far.
@ Candy
Starmer: Wolf in sheep’s clothing comes to mind.
I noticed how the Labour party members started overhauling their dress code after Boris was ousted. Suddenly the men began showing up to tv programmes wearing suits – not jumpers; shirts buttoned up – not casual poster tee shirts and even going so far as to wear ties, albeit poorly knotted, mostly looking uncomfortable; then the cutting back of facial hair, straggly beards, unruly hair until they looked more standard and almost carbon copies of conservatives. The Women clothing code, hair and make up, less so and in the Commons are as colourfully, unstructured as ever.
Starmer said everything was fully costed – he kept hidden who he would be choosing to bear the brunt: everyones grandparent.
I have been giving some thought to the removal of Mrs Thatcher’s portrait, never visited 10 Downing Street but it occurs to me that if that study is traditionally used by all PMs, then it may well be properly designated PM’s study not named after anyone in particular. As for the portrait after a time one would become used to it and little by little forget whose it is, however what one could not escape is the predominant colour, black is not a creative colour not conducive to thinking, so maybe that is why Keir Starmer finds it unsettling, relocating the portrait to a more public place in the building may do it more justice as it can be enjoyed by more people passing by.
It was, of course, KS’s birthday yesterday. No Solar Return without a birth time, but this week’s confusing Mars in Gemini square Neptune in Pisces offers one theme. Active spirits, noisy scandals, foggy fractured actions? More water company scandal news? Pluto has just returned to Capricorn on the actual birthday, 2nd September. A last hurrah for Capricorn themes?
Both the Mars/Neptune square and Pluto aspect the Thatcher/Starmer composite Sun, and are calling to the turbulent fixed star Scheat in Pegasus. Something must be overcome, Pegasus soars upwards, his rider falls to earth. Of potential interest, too, is how these aspects might trigger the 1066 Moon at 29 Pisces – representing ‘the people’ – and coincidentally opposing the KS/Thatcher composite Virgo Sun.
Well the only comment I will make as Sun\Pluto conjunction myself in Leo , with my Moon opposite his Mars is – I fight for the people he has just put second in this country. Not the Heating Allowance, as that always needed means testing. For the fact he didn’t have the guts to say it. A Sun/Pluto in Leo like me thinks wimp! What else would I think. His Mars in Cancer trine his Neptune in Scorpio can be quite devious along with hiding things until Scorpio wishes to sting. This may have served him well in his court cases, yet now he is the leader of a Democracy – it needs tempering. . He is not a judging/lawyer telling us what to do now. No need of a wig! We all know the dark side of Pluto/Scorpio, which with his Sun /Pluto in Virgo sextile his Neptune in Scorpio he can be concise, cutting, ruthless and determined. Neptune’s charm could masquerade quite a ruthless person. The Sun is a leader, Pluto is politics deep and controlling , combined it is a powerful combination, that can be misused . I have found it to be the Planets regulator. People born with this conjunction are here to learn to use leadership and power responsibly. Keir Starmer has his Pluto/Sun conjunction opposite his Saturn in Aquarius, with transiting Pluto next year nudging his Saturn and the following year in very close orb. If he doesn’t temper his power as a new leader , that transition will teach him a lesson.
Correction Saturn is not opposite Sun/Pluto. Getting mixed up with my own Leo Sun/Pluto.
What we know about Sue Gray, is that during the ‘troubles’ in Northern Ireland – while running a pub – news articles documented her as having a good relationship with the IRA. I have no idea whether this was because they were her customers or whether there were other reasons.
There were various rumours of her being a British spy, rather than helping the IRA. She even took the step of making a formal announcement that she was not. Taking a career break is not unusual in itself though she was a civil servant straight out of school but the British Government were running operations of that type from the 70’s to 90’s. Add in that her birthday is not in the public domain which is somewhat strange for someone so high up, she intrigues me.
Concerning her birth date my gut feeling is that she is a Virgo. Marjorie I have sent you some information.
Majorie, the contact page is not working currently, my message will not send, just to let you know.
Hi all again. I know people with similar “horrific” or challenging aspects in their birth charts to many celebs that have been discussed on this site. To my knowledge, none are axe murderers, tyrants, power mad despots etc etc. I realise that I am Pollyanna here , but could it be that something about free will or self awareness is being missed? Or life lessons and the nodes influence/ previous life experiences? I know astrology works, but I am so uncomfortable with basing dismissive judgements on certain aspects when I see people living excellent lives with precisely those aspects. I know I’m repeating myself, but I believe people are often better than their charts suggest – maybe the “best” characters are the ones that overcome their awful aspects and we are rather lazy at looking more deeply.
I do agree and am probably guilty of it myself. Some of the worst people I’ve ever come across have Grand trines in Earth and positive Sun/Jupiter aspects and yet others with a Scorpio emphasis, packed 12th house or a challenging Pluto or Saturn are highly evolved. I just don’t believe that you can tell the calibre of an individual from a single aspect or their chart alone, nor can you diagnose things like personality disorders.
I wish we could isolate what makes the difference. I incline towards the idea that our challenging aspects are our life lessons, and that some people meet them and others just run away. Any ideas gratefully received!
It’s the challenging aspects in my own chart which have led to development I believe rather than the easy ones. My Venus trine Jupiter is lovely but not much use for psychological growth and insight, instead my Sun square Saturn and Pluto on the ascendant, though painful – especially when younger – have been the grit in the oyster.
Having an amateur interest in astrology myself, I’ve always believed and felt that a natal chart does not show the condition of the soul. It is the condition of the soul which depends on how the chart is ‘lived.’ Whether good or bad.
So a highly evolved soul is not going to murder people or commit crimes, no matter how many challenging aspects they have which might suggest that.
Similarly, a young soul (for want of a better description) is not going to fully grow into a glowing chart with lots of positive aspects. I read somewhere that astrological energies seek to express themselves within the confines of whichever environment they find themselves. In other words, the natal aspects of a chart do seek expression, but that expression can vary tremendously even for people with extremely similar charts.
At least, this is my current hypothesis!
This probably needs a strand to itself but off the top of my head. People do not always/most often live out all of their charts. Gauquelin found the most successful/prominent did.
And of course there is always a negative or positive way of handling any of the aspects/planets – though how much of that is choice and how much not, I have never understood.
What I do know – having been blessed or cursed with an exceptionally porous 12th house – is that most people live on the surface and bury all the garbage underground or never retrieve it. It was one of the reasons I went into astrology because I did not understand people. They seemed nice, sweet natured etc but they didn’t feel that way.
So in my meddling Virgo way if I come across as ‘horrific’ chart that is not being lived out I would niggle away trying to find out where the energy manifests – either being handed over to a partner or dumped onto the next generation.
I have a sense that in order for society’s glue to hang together, individuals are forced to bury part of their individuality (and chart) in order to fit in. So their more murderous traits for example do not get lived out – except in watching crime and murder dramas on TV and violence in movies. I have always found it odd that we (me included) have such a fascination for novels/dramas about corpses, killings and the like.
These are just random thoughts. Earth Grand Trines can be gross – and Jupiter can bring undeserved luck and self-righteousness. So part of the problem may be over hopeful interpretations.
I will may try to think of examples – the problem is the kinds of people who have horror charts and don’t appear to live them out are most often very ordinary – but if you investigate their lives and families, it’ll be in there somewhere.
Thanks Marjorie, that is so helpful. Even as a child I could sense the darkness in other people as well as in myself and that’s probably why I was drawn to astrology. It came as no surprise that my natal chart happened to have Pluto rising and a Scorpio stellium and I thought, ‘well, that figures’.
Thank you all for your input. So, if we don’t express our dark side in our outward life, but keep it hidden or expressed in less harmful ways, that does indicate some self awareness and potential for growth that a stranger may not see by looking at a birth chart.
I think I’ll stick with my aversion to condemnation then!
I think thats an overly positive take. Keeping something hidden does not automatically indicate self awareness or some sort of evolved personality. ‘I have a sense that in order for society’s glue to hang together, individuals are forced to bury part of their individuality (and chart) in order to fit in’ this is the important bit, it may not even be conscious, it may be carried out in passive agressive ways which are considered more acceptable by society, it may express itself but deception is used to cover up cruel or selfish behaviour.
And even if it is pushed down it will express itself anyway by coming at you from another person. I am not here regularly but I rarely see ‘condemnation’ what I do see and what I have contributed myself is years of observation of how particular parts of a chart express themselves ‘most’ of the time. It is not condemnation to point out those likely results of a particular aspects, or to struggle to see a positive way for an aspect to be expressed. Are all Neptune Mercury aspects or Neptune/ASC for example inherently ‘dishonest’? No, but they are as a rule more likely to manipulate the facts by omission, or deception either to themselves of their own motivations, or to others.
It all feels a little bit BBC trying to give equal weight to both sides, sometimes an aspect, a house planet combination really is more likely to have negative side effects, it’s more healthy to accept that and when you see that aspect to be aware rather than trying to make it all nice.
You are quite right in much of what you say, and it is difficult to always be positive. I suppose I believe in giving the benefit of the doubt rather more than many others. You and I disagree about condemnatory language – I see it often here- but that may be due to different interpretations of what that constitutes. I do think there is more to a person’s path than the standard birth chart interpretation shows – maybe the nodes need a proper study – and I do think the challenges in the chart are a test to use well and some people fail. However, you can’t tell which is which from the chart so it’s best not to assume the worst in someone ( till you have the evidence)
Do you worry about confirmation bias? As in, finding a negative correlation so keep digging until you find a positive one somewhere? How do you balance and control for this?
If I understand you correctly, I suppose I do. I’m very aware of my own bias and sometimes work myself to a standstill trying to be fair. I really struggle with the idea that astrologers are able to leave their pet hates behind when looking at a chart. Political bias especially is often on show and my other favourite astrologer ( who shall be nameless) has irritated me several times by showing her political preference almost as a way of persuasion.
I know that prior to her political career Margaret Thatcher was a chemist. Do you know why she dropped a career that she worked so hard for to go into politics?
@Linda Margaret Thatcher became a chemist then trained as a barrister, she was always interested in politics, having been involved at Oxford whilst an undergraduate. She was proud of the fact that she was probably the first scientist to become Prime Minister and of course the first woman.
Of some interest is the connection with John Major, her mother and his grandmother were sisters, although there may have been little contact between the two families.
Many years ago, when Keir was just a barrister, by chance I spent the day with him and other lawyers and court professionals in a European city after a successful conclusion to a case at which he assisted. It was a day of eating, drinking and merry making and socialising.
It was the one and only time I met him but what I vividly remember from that wonderful day was how friendly, easy, gossipy and approachable Keir was. Just a matey one of the guys. A friend who was present that day worked with him on many occasions and also spoke of him as a likeable, friendly, no-airs kind of person.
But then he was a civilian, if you like, and now he has the most serious and grim grown-up job in the country.
So he has a serious and grown-up persona.
Is that any surprise? Personally, what I want from a Prime Minister is discernment, integrity and efficiency.
Absolutely the last thing I’d want is charm and charisma.
Because – oops – we had that before and look where it got us…
Without turning this into a political discussion, in the interests of balance, may I point out that Starmer has reneged on every policy he asked us to support at the 2019 election and distanced himself from Corbyn, who he said was the best person to be Prime Minister. Does he, a well-off man, need to have a Party donor paying for his spectacles and suits? And he said he wouldn’t pay for private treatment for a close relative if they were suffering and on a long NHS waiting list. Are there two Keir Starmer’s? Will he say anything to gain power?
Thanks Lorna for some perspective. I’ve tried hard not to get involved in this, but I agree with David that this seems like any excuse for an attack. Obama removed Churchill’s portrait and I think one’s workspace should be comfortable for you to work in, especially as PM or President. I expect Lady Thatcher will be back in place the next time the Conservatives win the election and that’s fine by me.
Speaking as an American who lived in England for a long time during school and university and still follows UK politics (as well as American politics closely), I’d like to say a word in favor of charm and charisma.
Used judiciously and appropriately, both traits are useful in helping a leader or gifted politician persuade the public of the benefits of their policies, to build support and explain why people should endure short-term pain, such as tax increases, for long-term gain, such as improved services. In the US Lyndon Johnson, for example, was not known as a charismatic politician, but could turn on the charm when twisting arms to gain support for his policies. Legislatively he was one of the most successful American presidents. Both Bill Clinton and Barach Obama are also charismatic but because of differing political climates weren’t able to translate it into such political wins.
In contrast you in the UK have recently seen the flip side of a politician’s exploitation of charm and charisma (as we in the US are seeing now in one orange candidate), to sell a snake oil salesman’s agenda, built on lies and self-interest.
So — there are pluses and minuses to a politician’s charm and charisma. It all comes down to basic character. (Apologies for the lack of astrology — though I’m sure there must be astrological markers for these traits.)
I would like it if he could answer a question without it being such a struggle for him. And it is every single question. For a barrister you would think he would be prepared for such things. But not Keir.
Thanks Marjorie. A rather odd story isn’t it? With Starmer’s strong Neptune, I wondered about his choice of the word “unsettling” for the portrait hanging in the Thatcher Room. Could this be something to do with his intuition or Neptunian sensitivity? Margaret Thatcher visited every PM who came after her. Here’s her visit to Gordon Brown, on 13 September 2007:
“Former prime minister Baroness Thatcher returned to Downing Street earlier for an hour of private talks with Gordon Brown and a tour of Number 10.
Lady Thatcher, 81, spent more than two hours at her former home, where she was greeted with a handshake from the PM.
Mr Brown recently surprised many by praising Labour’s long-time political foe as a “conviction politician”.” BBC archived website
Perhaps she’s keeping up the tradition, and “visiting” Keir Starmer in ghostly form?! She had an interest in the paranormal, and consulted more than one guru or clairvoyant before becoming PM.
10 Downing Street has a number of resident ghosts. One is called “The Lady”, sometimes in pink, sometimes in white. Both Labour PM Harold Wilson, and his cleaner, are reported to have seen her. There’s also Spencer Perceval, British PM who was assassinated in 1812. He’s said to appear at times of national crisis…..
It is completely normal to rearrange the furniture when you move into a new house. US Presidents do the same without controversy when they move into the White House. This all smacks of a culture of piling on for the slightest excuse.
Thatcher is generally regarded as bit more of an important figure in the U.K. than most 20th century PMs. She won three General Elections in a row. Most people would rank her alongside Lloyd George, Churchill and Attlee in significance. Her portrait was also located in the Thatcher Room in No 10 which was once her study. I don’t know what is acceptable behaviour in the USA but some British people might think Starmer’s behaviour is both ungentlemanly and shows a lack of class.
@Hugh
Starmer’s behaviour is both ungentlemanly and shows a lack of class.
I am certain millions of Britons would agree with you. But I am sure many others think that form -or in this case, state decor etiquette- should follow function. People who think of that No 10 study not as a shrine, but as a place of work. If an official wants to make his working environment a bit more comfortable for himself, i.e. if he can concentrate more, and serve the nation that way, what harm is there in relocating a painting, really?
I am an abstract painter. I live with a realist portrait painter. So I have a bit of experience with this. This painter’s mom turned a beautiful portrait we gave her to the wall, and in the end her discomfort was such that she gave it back to us, expensive frame and all. Large frontal portraiture is not for everybody. It doesn’t have to be Diane Arbus or Stanley Kubrick to disturb. It really affects people differently.
@HF Wise words regarding Mrs Thatcher she certainly left a mark in this country, whether all her legacy is good or bad depends on results, she begun to undo Clement Attlee’s work with mixed outcomes and now there is a country with extremes, time will tell, although the rising tide of homeless may be one of her most enduring mementoes.
Beautifully executed portrait nevertheless.
I lived in London during Thatcher’s time and I wouldn’t want her portrait on my wall.
It is very odd behaviour given the portrait was commissioned by Gordon Brown, a Labour Prime Minister. I am not sure quite what message Starmer is trying to send given that Thatcher died in 2013 and ceased to be a Prime Minister 34 years ago in 1990. This means no one under 40 in Britain has any real memory of Thatcher’s time in office and only those over 55 would have had an opportunity to vote for her in her last General Election victory in 1987.
I might understand the action if Starmer was committed to rolling back Thatcher’s more controversial economic policies such as water privatisation but given Labour had 13 years to do that under Blair/Brown it seems unlikely it going to happen under this government. This makes the action just look petty and mean spirited.
It all rather ties in with some of Starmer’s other policy initiatives such as hounding smokers out of public parks and pub gardens or abolishing the winter fuel allowance for old age pensioners. I suppose with Sun/Pluto conjunct in Virgo one might expect Starmer to come over as rather priggish, unlikeable bossy boots. That won’t matter if Starmer can actually use the Virgo ability to master detail so that the government actually gets things done unlike its hapless Tory predecessors. Unfortunately, Virgo’s are also prone to not seeing the wood for the trees so one wonders if Starmer’s administration will end up frittering away its energy and its majority fussing over minor issues while ignoring the big problems.
It’s just so incomprehensible that of all things Starmer has decided to clamp down on, he chooses a smoking prohibition. It’s not as though hospitality businesses haven’t gone through enough turmoil and loss of income already, following COVID which had a devastating impact on the industry. As for the winter fuel payment withdrawal, he has managed to alienate quite a significant portion of the electorate in order to save a relatively small amount of money. His actions thus far really don’t fill me with confidence or hope.
He comes across as so corruptible (hence weak) – a negative manifestation of Jupiter and Pluto (and Chiron)? A prominent Neptune seems plausible.
There’ve been recent reports suggesting Starmer has received more freebies than any other MP since 2019, including “work clothing”, and spectacles worth over two thousand pounds from a wealthy (and influential) Labour donor. Another big money Labour donor was to take up a place within the Treasury which sparked a cronyism row, as well as an investigation into civil service appointments by Labour since they took up office two months. Clearly power matters.
I don’t blame him, frankly. Thatcher did so much damage to our country. I would hate for her to dominate any room.
Ann, I think someone got sued for naming names with the suggestion that it was just a political smear. So best wait to see if it hits the mainstream for safety’s sake.
The more I look at his chart the tougher it gets. That yod of Sun Pluto sextile Mars inconjunct Saturn in Aquarius – is ruthless and cold. Never mind the Kite with that Sun Pluto opposition Jupiter Chiron which is super-charged confidence and control freaky.
Ok, thanks Marjorie
I find him strongly authoritarian, to the point of genuine concern. Some people in this tribal society and media seem to have forgotten that the negative aspects ascribed to one group are not only held by them, authoritarianism is just as at home on the left as on the right. Plus Neptune on the Asc sitting in the 12th house? I know all those Gemini leaders cannot be relied upon to be honest but that apsect alone should be a red flag of a person who does not even think they are being dishonest when they are.
There is a comment on this thread about how aspects manifest in different people. I had a little look to find someone who shares Sir K’s birthday. There is an illustrator/caricaturist/portrait artist and children’s author, Jon Gregory. He does caricatures for The New Statesman, Economist and others, although he hasn’t done one of Kier yet that I can see. I notice the Libra planets which can be creative, perhaps then it is versions of the truth or portraying things almost, but not quite, as they are. It’s a different manifestation of the energy though.
@Candy, you can admire someone — e g , their strength, determination and persistence — yet find them oppressive and not want a portrait surveilling you constantly, especially if you oppose the policies she brought in. I can totally understand his wanting to move a portrait from what’s now his work space. That happens all the time in the US when a president of a new party comes in and changes the symbolic “decor” of the Oval Office, especially the paintings, portraits and busts of former presidents.
But how the move was handled was probably ham-handed. Starmer seems to lack strong interpersonal skills and political instincts, so essential for a successful political leader in a democratic country, especially in a time of needed change and tough choices.
@Nicole
I think you nailed it. The problem is that it’s a superb painting. It feels like one if those presences that follow you around the room in haunted houses in theme parks.
@Lucy, probably not a very comfortable presence, no matter the quality of the art?
I for one would find her presence, always looking, always judging, extremely uncomfortable as I’m trying to do a difficult job and thread the needle of public policy changes during fraught times. I’d probably move her portrait to a more public place, like the entrance hall to No. 10, where visitors and staff could admire the artistry of the portrait and discuss her significance as PM. I have to admit I’d prefer a more whimsical portrait of Larry the Cat in my work space, to bring me down to earth and put me in my place!
I would like it if he could answer a question without it being such a struggle for him. And it is every single question. For a barrister you would think he would be prepared for such things. But not Keir.
I think I saw David Cameron pointing out all the portraits of past Prime Ministers at 10 Downing Street. It does seem churlish of him. Those portraits represent our history.
Crikey, Ann! I hope whoever is putting out those accusations is anonymous for their own sake! Remember he was Director of Public Prosecutions, he’s a lawyer! I look at him and think those things can’t be true ….but then I recall that at the 2019 election he urged us to vote for Jeremy Corbyn and defends that behaviour by saying he knew Corbyn, now thrown out of his Party, wouldn’t win and become Prime Minister! Forked tongue?
Some commentators are contrasting the positivity of the recent Democratic National Convention in the USA to Starmer’s gloomy, downcast lecturing. It has to be said that Starmer has had what is possibly the shortest honeymoon ever as PM. Personally I find him to be a little like the headmaster of a 1970s comprehensive school – ‘all those 5th formers caught smoking behind the bikesheds, please report to Mrs. Rayner’s office for detention’, kind of thing. Treating us like children which, with their tendency to nanny the country Labour governments are wont to do. The thing is, the electorate have suffered already, with years of Tory austerity followed by the pandemic and they are hurting badly. Starmer’s tin-eared speech didn’t fill me with confidence.
Feels to me like Starmer is going to be the wrong guy for the upcoming Saturn/Neptune in Aries, Uranus in Gemini, Pluto in Aqua – those are positive, outgoing signs – his chart is so cautious. I genuinely suspect he would have done a good job of righting the country 15 years ago when Pluto in Capricorn handed us austerity.
He’s been listening to and following Blair’s advice to get this far. Difference is, Blair has the Gemini planets to pull off the positive messaging and harness the energy that came with Uranus/Neptune in Aqua / Pluto in Sag.
The honeymoon is over because there never really was one. Many people who voted Labour did so because they wanted to ensure the Tories didn’t get back in; not because they wanted what Starmer was offering.
Interesting comments about a prominent Saturn. I’ve often wondered about Saturn getting a slightly unmerited bad reputation as it seems to give gravitas and maturity also. My husband has Saturn rising in Scorpio, tightly sextile his sun in Virgo. He guards his privacy and is naturally cautious, but oddly is the life and soul of any party and is definitely a “ performer” in that situation . Also, he is the most amazing player of children’s games and is very imaginative with it – kids adore him! I’ve put it down to moon in Leo in his tenth as the only other person I know with this placement has the same characteristics. Maybe, too, it’s his Jupiter tightly conjunct his MC. Any thoughts anyone? Saturn definitely controls his inner life, but he’s no control freak.
All those cheery, partyish, jolly parts of his personality are probably that Moon in Leo, though Moon in Leo can often signify a person wanting the spotlight badly only to be uncomfortable when getting it or not liking it. Something like that.
My Dad had Moon in Leo square Saturn in Leo. He had older parents with his father aged 65 when he was born. My grandmother married a man 23 years older than she was. My father had certain childlike qualities and was very good at playing the clown and making us laugh.
*Sorry, Moon in Leo square Saturn in Scorpio.
Thank you Virgoflake too. It’s lovely that a moon can be transformative. Saturn, I think, may age its people well.
You’re so right! He actually hates the spotlight but can’t seem to help being in it in certain situations- it’s really odd! And he’s so good at it that it’s like a different person at times. Luckily I need variety in my life ! What surprises me is that this Leo moon totally overpowers his Saturn with such ease. Actually now I think of it, his moon is technically conjunct his Jupiter as well.
This was for El Aznar – can’t seem to get this reply thing right!
Hi. My son has moon in Leo at 1 degree in the 7th. I think he would be a great stand up comic. A friend of his urged him to submit something The Onion, a parody newspaper. I think a part of him does want the spotlight and I could also see him shying away from that and ultimately forgoing it. Does this mean any marriage may be jovial and light hearted in nature? Might this also mean that his ideal mate would be a fire sign? His Venus is in Pisces-he loves art (art history major). Thanks! Helpful.
Thanks Aim for this! Stand up comic totally describes my experience of moon in Leo. You’d have to check in with a real astrologer for relationship issues, but my husband has definitely kept me laughing now for 40 years ( despite his Saturn)
cold and arrogant .Probably thinks he’s cleverer than he is .I think he’ll be gone like all those tory prime ministers in 2years at the most
Given his academic and profession, I think he is pretty clever
Starmer seems grim and humourless, and that usually means a prominent Saturn. (Thatcher famously didn’t get jokes, and she had Saturn rising).
I’d say Starmer had cold Aquarius rising with Saturn near the ascendant. And Neptune on the midheaven to fit with the fibs he told, first to the Labour membership, and then the wider electorate. (The article he wrote in the Telegraph before the election about how he admired Maggie was almost certainly a fib).
Regardless, tr Pluto will approach his Saturn next year, and he’ll get grimmer.