Is the USA heading for civil war? The inflammatory Steve Bannon is drawing comparisons with 1860 when the election of Abraham Lincoln led to the southern states seceding and the civil war followed a few months later. More serious and credible voices are also raising concerns that political instability is likely to worsen without reform of immigration and inequality, perhaps peaking around 2020, making the USA “particularly vulnerable to violent upheaval”. (See URL below).
Historian Victor Hanson commented that history has repeatedly shown that “zealous and sometimes warring tiny minorities can escalate tensions, nullify opposition and bully the silenced majority to sanction — or at least not object to — violence”.
The 2021 Inauguration chart certainly looks extremely volatile and combustible with a Mars Uranus square Sun, Saturn, Jupiter. But is nothing like as brutal as Abraham Lincoln’s Inauguration on 4 March 1861 which had a Mars Pluto in Taurus conjunction trine Saturn; and Uranus in early Gemini on its first Return to the USA 1776 chart in a conflicted square to Saturn.
The USA First President chart 30 April 1789 12.45pm shows up the Civil War most clearly with tr Pluto moving to conjunct the Taurus Sun which is a classic break-up influence; with the Solar Arc midheaven conjunct Uranus to within half a degree. There is certainly high anxiety on this chart in the run up to the 2020 election with tr Uranus conjunct the Sun from July 2020 onwards, into early 2021. Which isn’t as strong as tr Pluto in 1860/61, but will produce considerable tensions bringing troublemakers and revolutionary spirits to the fore. There will also be major panic and concern from tr Neptune hovering around the conjunction to Solar Arc Uranus and the natal Saturn. With more upheavals as tr Pluto opposes the Uranus in 2023/204 and a serious setback in 2024 with Solar Arc Saturn opposing the Sun.
The USA 1776 chart which lacks an accurate start time though I use 11 am had on this time tr Neptune conjunct the Descendant and square the midheaven over the start of the 1861 Civil War; with another high-tension Saturn Uranus collision.
The fanatical Mercury opposition Pluto in this chart which spawned Mcarthyism and Watergate amongst other eruptions when it was triggered, is directly in the line of fire of the tr Saturn Pluto Jupiter over the 2020 election. And has tr Neptune square the USA Mars from March 2021 onwards into 2022 which is panicky failure. With indications of a destructive setback in 2024 when the Solar Arc Saturn in conjunct Mars. And the Pluto Return running in 2022/23.
So no solution in sight for a healing of the fault lines which have widened catastrophically with Trump’s hate rhetoric.
Bannon, 27 November 1953, who’s been jaunting round Europe stoking up the far-right populist parties, is becoming more fanatical over the next four years with his Uranus, North Node, Neptune T Square being pounded by tr Pluto – which could end up in devastation for him or megalomania running rampant. He looks disappointed now into early 2019; scattering wildly in 2019; pushing ahead with high confidence in 2020 but running into road blocks in 2021. Like Trump he’s always lived in excited and aggressive chaos, with his multiple schemes usually ending in failure. Which doesn’t mean he couldn’t cause damage before he implodes and moves on.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/america-is-edging-closer-to-civil-war-jqvnv8f0n
US natal chart/2021 inaugural charts: Neptune-Opposition-Neptune. The Deceived. (Astromatrix)
Deceived myself, lol. Neptune opposition Neptune is disappointment, having unattainable expectations
Seriously, though, the run-up to the midterm election is so hijacked by horrible people making horrible news that I’m cutting free from the news until after I’ve gone to the polls. The only scary thing I want to see this week is kids in costumes saying “Trick or Treat”.
Even then I’m afraid you won’t escape horrible people – quite a few Donald Trump hallowe’en costumes doing the rounds this year!
Ha! LOL
What about KellyAnne as Bride of Frankenstein?
I’ll get some granola bars to give them! The really dry, hard, barely sweet kind. Like their leader.
That is a question a bit beyond my capabilities.
I dont think looking at a national chart alone would explain events because the personality of individuals such as Charles I in the English civil war is often crucial to how the conflicts play out
With regard to the US all I would say is that the Mars Uranus Conjunction at the outbreak of the US Civil War is within 1 degree of the Uranus at 8° Gemini in the US Declaration of Independence Chart.
It would probably be a good idea for all sides in US politics to turn the dial down on the rhetoric for the good of the nation but I dont suppose that is likely to happen under the current influences.
Usually civil conflicts occur when those in power or their opponents refuse to contemplate the need for compromise. For example, in the English Civil War, Charles I unwillingness to negotiate with Parliament undoubtedly triggered a war that cost tens of thousands of lives.
The English Civil War is usually marked as formally beginning when Charles I raised his standard at Nottingham at 6.15 pm on 22 August 1642. At that date Mars at 9° Taurus opposed Uranus at 8° Scorpio. Interestingly, Uranus and Mars were conjunct at 9° Gemini on 17 April 1861 only 5 days after fighting started in the US Civil War at Fort Sumter and on the exact date on which the Virginia convention voted to secede from the Union. If the USA is going to descend into that sort of conflict then I would expect some sort of Mars and Uranus aspects to be involved.
I checked a few more Civil War charts to see if those Uranus Mars aspects are indeed a common feature at the outbreak of fighting. It certainly hold good for the Irish Civil War which started on 28 June 1922 when Mars at 13° Sagittarius squared Uranus at 13° Pisces exactly. Mars and Uranus were conjunct at 15° Aries on 12 March 2015 just a few days before the current civil war in Yemen began.
Thank you for that, Hugh. It seems that a Mars Uranus conjunction/opposition is a trigger for civil wars in general, somewhere in the world.
But how does that interact with specific country charts? What star combination causes the civil war to erupt in a specific country?
When does that kind of mars/uranus aspect occur? Thanks.
Frequently. Uranus is a fairly slow planet but Mars completes a trip through the zodiac in about 2 years. That means Mars will conjunct, square, or oppose Uranus every six months or so.
For example, in 2019 Mars will conjoin Uranus in Taurus on February 13, square it (Leo to Taurus) on July 11, and oppose it (Scorpio to Taurus) on November 24.
Speaking of Civil Wars, I don’t think we give Neptune in Pisces enough credit for (Civil) Wars. Last time we had this influence was from 1847 to 1862, and that period saw Revolutions of 1848, Crimean War (coincidence?), Italian Unification, though not actual fighting ascendance of Wilhelm I to Prussian throne and nomination of Bismarck as Prime Minister (which lead to very bloody war with Denmark by 1864) and the beginning of US Civil War. These wars had, generally speaking, horrendous mortality rates through military technique having advanced well beyond medicine (the peak coming with Paraguyan War that killed off 90 to 95 per cent of the adult male population of the country).
Wow, you really tied that all together for us. Thanks!
Was looking for the red flag that would engage trump’s base this week, and it has emerged. Gab.com, the alt-right social network, has been taken down by its host site Go Daddy. This is major. It’s already being attributed as a response to the Synagogue shooting, which riles up the underworld of trump’s supporters even more.
Ms. Orr (or one of your talented fans), how does this compare to the chart of the USSR breakup? We don’t refer to that as a Civil War, perhaps because it was successful and generally without major violence. Could something like that be happening to the US?
Although it would be sad to see the American dream fade away, it may be fate for some states to secede and form new countries. Large blue states are financially harvested to support states that are ideologically and culturally incompatible, rather like colonialism. And large states like Texas and California, and additional Southwestern states, may need to revert to hispanic or Native American origins by splitting from the US. Some like Utah may want to wall off their religious way of life.
Just riffing on possibilities. I’m not going to be a agitating on here for separatism. However, we must consider what’s happening. Getting a heads up from the charts is valuable because it helps us to prepare for the worst, and the best.
From memory it was tr Pluto conjunct the Scorpio Sun what was around for the fall of the USSR – as predicted by Liz Greene some years earlier. So not similar.
Thank you for looking into this, you are so attentive and kind to your readers. Was hoping the US might get by with something “less than” a Civil War or an Evangelical Constitution, but looks like the rough ride ahead can’t be avoided. However, it can be endured, and even build character and wisdom, if we don’t fear it. You help us with that.
I second the appreciation for the support that you give us who participate on your site. I am exploring various ways of interpretation and I appreciate that you explain your thinking and assist us with tools, such as updating this page with the chart I requested below. Thank you, Marjorie.
There was Saturn transit to Pluto on November Revolution chart that preceeded Fall of Soviet Union, though. I think this had a lot to do with abandonment of the Revolutiory Myth.
Saturn was in Capricorn 1988-1990. And it did oppose November Revolution Pluto early in 1989. It was still months before cracking down of Soviet Bloc became apparent to larger public in West. But those who knew artists – and artists were a good indicator of what was going on in Soviet Bloc, because they were esteemed and feared – behind The Iron Curtain knew something was up when Soviets wouldn’t, or couldn’t enforce “The Party Line” they way they used to.
“The USA First President chart 30 April 1789 12.45pm shows up the Civil War most clearly with tr Pluto moving to conjunct the Taurus Sun which is a classic break-up influence; with the Solar Arc midheaven conjunct Uranus to within half a degree. There is certainly high anxiety on this chart in the run up to the 2020 election with tr Uranus conjunct the Sun from July 2020 onwards, into early 2021. Which isn’t as strong as tr Pluto in 1860/61, but will produce considerable tensions bringing troublemakers and revolutionary spirits to the fore.”
Just as tr Pluto (which destroys in order to recreate/rebuild) conjunct the US First President Sun suggests a President whose election precipitated the Civil War (states started to secede soon after his election, even before he was sworn in), I suggest that tr Uranus conjunct the US First President Sun suggests a President who would either lead or cause a revolution.
Based on political rumblings (both conservatives and liberals seem to be calling for it on Twitter; the former to make the existing one stricter, the latter to rewrite it), it may even be possible that the US has a Constitutional Convention and gets a second Constitution. Is there a chart for the US Constitution as a document/law itself and does that show any distress and/or death/end in the early 2020s?
Also, Marjorie, I had a look at the US First President’s chart in the earlier post on the topic, but can you publish the US First President’s chart along with the 2021 Presidential inauguration chart (the way you have done above, with an inner and outer chart), for us to get a better understanding of the interplay between the two?
A Constitutional Convention would be dreadful considering the imbalance of power at this time. The US would end up having a Christian-Corporate Power-NRA Constitution.
Disagree – a Fascist Constitution would emerge.
“… tr Pluto (which destroys in order to recreate/rebuild) conjunct the US First President Sun suggests a President whose election precipitated the Civil War…”
The elements for secession were already in motion prior to Lincoln’s election. The economic base of the South was labor-based. The economy of the North was “modern” in comparison to an agrarian economy. “The United States had become increasingly divided during the 1850s over sectional disagreements, especially regarding the extension of slavery into the territories.” (wiki)
Strongly challenge that Lincoln “caused” the Americal civil war. It was bound to happen – whether with Lincoln or someone else at the wheel. Someone other than Lincoln would likely have delayed secession of the South.
A civil war never blows up over night or even over a year, it will have been building and building. What Lincoln’s Inauguration chart shows is what happened on his watch and he just happened to land – right time right place or wrong time wrong place depending on how you look at it – as tr Pluto had been conjunct the USA First Pres Venus in the years before and was moving towards the Sun.
Thank you!