Madonna’s first-born Lourdes Leon, a 25 year old model, actress, singer and influencer, has been holding forth about what a control freak her mother is. Isn’t that a surprise? Lourdes said: “She has controlled me my whole life. I needed to be completely independent from her as soon as I graduated high school.” She reportedly paid her own college tuition and rented her own Brooklyn apartment. Though she softened the criticism by saying she admires her mother for being “empowering to other women”, “ahead of her time” and being an exceptionally hard worker.
Lourdes was born 14 October 1996 4.01 pm Los Angeles, the daughter of fitness trainer Carlos Leon, whose relationship with Madonna broke up a few months after her birth.
She has an intense 8th house Libra Sun in a creative though vague square to Neptune; a charming actressy Venus in Virgo in her 7th; and a confident, lucky Cardinal T Square of Mercury in Libra opposition Saturn in forced-to-be-self-reliant Aries square Jupiter in Capricorn. She won’t be short of initiative or resourcefulness. She has an intense Scorpio Moon in an impatient-with-mother square to Mars in Leo. Her Moon is in the 9th suggesting she’ll live abroad at some point and her opinionated Pluto is also in her 9th in a tough-minded trine to Saturn.
She won’t be a slouch when it comes to hard work herself.
The synastry with her mother is quite tricky with Madonna’s self-righteous, overly rigid Saturn in Sagittarius in Lourdes’s 10th house of career, so mom would teach her discipline. Madonna’s controlling Pluto is also exactly conjunct Lourdes’s Descendant which won’t make room for much compromise; and even less so given Madonna’s Leo Sun being conjunct Lourdes’ Mars – combustible and liable to erupt at any point.
But there are all manner of plus points as well – Madonna’s Jupiter conjunct L’s Sun, Madonna’s Moon in L’s 7th and Madonna’s Venus softening Lourdes’ Saturn trine Pluto.
One of these can’t live with them can’t live without them family dynamics.
The relationship chart has a possessive composite Moon Pluto conjunction; a volatile Mars trine Uranus; and a high-tension Saturn square Uranus. Not a disaster but not a recipe for 24/7 harmony.
It pretty much reflects what anyone associated with Madonna, have said for years now, Madonna micro manages everyone in her environment. She is very lucky to have a daughter. Maybe she needs to learn to soften her approach with Lourdes. Being over bearing with daughters often sends them running away, which is the last thing Madonna would want.
Madonna lost her mother to cancer at a young age. No doubt the drive to control also produces the abandonment from others that she most fears.
Def a celebrity I don’t want to meet. She’s way too unconscious. Plenty of others like her but they’re mostly male. Madonna had issues with modelling her femininity on a mother. Her constant attention seeking must be draining.
>> “Her Moon is in the 9th suggesting she’ll live abroad at some point” <<
She lived in England when Madge was with Guy Ritchie. Think she was sent to Cheltenham Girl's College – I guess that's money well spent for being an influencer (joke).
Think Guy Ritchie has Mars in Leo too so wonder how she got along with him.
Jonathan Cainer wrote ‘No matter what sign your mother was born under, you will somehow ‘see’ her as having the characteristics of your own moon sign. People with Moon in Scorpio see their mothers as intense.’ I did but it may have been coming from me.
Yes, that’s the general theory because when you have two kids born in the same family, and they argue about how when they were growing up “mum was kind”, “mum was horrible” – it’s a problem for the validity of astrology.
It’s also backed up by how you react to people (your moon) shapes how they act/react to you.
That said, thinking about it now I’d never confuse my mum with my Leo moon. All work, no play. Not an ounce of creativity, playfulness, drama or expression.
Hmm not sure about that as a general immutable rule. No matter what Moon sign Lourdes had, she’d inevitably find Madonna tricky – a Leo Sun square Mars in Taurus and widely conjunct Pluto was never going to be an easy mom. Lourdes may take it to heart more and brood with a Scorpio Moon but isn’t wrong.
Not sure about it being a problem for astrology either. What different children in a family ‘see’ about their mother and the reality of who she is can be miles apart. For example Woody Harrelson with his Sagittarius Moon who overlooks his hitman father’s multifarious sins unlike his brothers who see him more clearly. One of whom oddly enough has a Scorpio Moon.
There is usually – this side of psychosis – a kernel of truth in what children see of parents, but one may accentuate the positive and the other the negative. They see a different facet of their character. And parents can act differently to different children – viz dysfunctional families where one poor kid is scapegoated and the others are treated reasonably.
Great, quick yet fleshed-out astro write up Marjorie.
“One of these can’t live with them can’t live without them family dynamics”
This is the impression that I always get from them when I happen to see them interact on social media, or in the press.
There’s love, but there’s teeth gritting — mostly from the daughter.
Madonna has that sun/pluto conj. In 12th house. It’s always intrigued me. Hard control behind the scenes.
Madonna was 38 when Lourdes was born, that was still considered to be an older Mother in the 1990’s. She also has Saturn in the first, this may also make her feel like her mother was older than most. Madonna’s Mercury has a Moon and Ascendent midpoint very close to it. She is prone to externalising her thoughts, which make make Lourd’s Saturn feel exposed. Aries likes to be in control. With a Mother who explicitly let the world know her feelings may well be filtered through that Moon/North Node/Pluto stellium in their composite 5th House. Children are mortified by their parents none conforming behaviour when they are growing up. My son has 9th house Moon in Sagittarius. I hadn’t thought about it until I read the above article. He too had worked abroad for a while.
A lot of women friends with Scorpio moons have hard issues with difficult, controlling, manipulative and “dark” mothers. Males too when I think about it. It’s a tricky placing for a warm and nurturing relationship with mum I think. Lots of head games, oneupmanship and passive aggressive games I’ve noticed.
My sibling has moon square Pluto (conj Asc) and I have an emphasised Pluto in the moon’s 4th house.
Our Mother ….lol.
In my experience, what you have described is absolutely correct, that’s all I’ll say on here. It’s hard to describe. It’s just utterly insidious.